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Gear ratios vs trigger response?

12K views 27 replies 10 participants last post by  Guges Mk3 
#1 ·
I looking to replace the self shimming gears of a vfc, and i am looking to increase trigger response. I've looked around and many people who have good trigger response builds use speed gears. However I read somewhere that high torque gears are also good for trigger response? I want to pull a m120 spring and i would prefer not to maximize my rps. So what ratio should i go with?
 
#2 ·
Speed gears, with a decent torquie motor, will almost always yield a faster trigger response than torque gears. But faster trigger response means a faster cycle and higher rof. They are directly related. Torque gears should only be used for an obscenely over powered spring. A better battery and motor will also increase trigger response without requiring you to open the gearbox
 
#3 ·
Damamabomb is right. I would recommend something along the lines of a 13:1 ratio and a strong, high torque motor like a JG Blue. The more torque the motor has, the better trigger response, and the slower the motor spins. This setup will cause you to have great trigger response, but not empty your magazine in an eighth of a second.
 
#4 ·
Well actually the shs 16:1s are good gears for moderate speed and good trigger response, also a lonex a2 motor is great. I would also replace the piston because vfc pistons are just plain and not very good, the lonex red piston or shs 15 metal tooth is a good choice. Here is another suggestion; put 13:1gears in and a lonex a1 motor (high speed and tourque setup) this will give you 30+ rps and crisp trigger response, i know you want the speed down so if you use an 7.4 lipo the response will be as good as the 11.1 but the speed will be just right :)


Build the best dont buy the best
 
#5 ·
Acually I am replacing the piston with a lonex red, I have heard that the vfc clear ones are bad although mine is a clear blue. I have a lonex a1 but should I get an a2 instead to bring the rof down a bit and have a greater trigger response?
 
#8 ·
I vote SHS 15 tooth. I've yet to have a problem with one. As for gears, SHS 13:1s will give the best trigger response. If you want to keep ROF down, use a torquey motor like a JG blue. Less speed=more torque which means better trigger response.

If you want really good trigger response, you could build a franken torque motor. I'm running SHS 13:1s with a 28TPA FT motor on an 11.1v lipo. Once it's finished, I'm planning on getting ~25 RPS with instant trigger response.
 
#9 ·
High torque gears have more teeth, which means for a given motor RPM, it will take more time to cycle through that gearset compared to a speed gearset which has less teeth, and as such, takes less time to cycle through the gearset. Speed gears will always produce a shorter cycle time than torque gears.
 
#11 ·
The shs piston is inconsistant. It is off by a lot because the whole that drills the spot for the piston is the same one that drills the whole for the ph. Although it has all metal teeth the red is still stronger, also if you have the a1 just keep it

Build the best dont buy the best
The SHS 15 teeth piston is actually significantly more durable than a Lonex Red piston. By the time a Lonex Red is worn out, an SHS 15T will barely have any visible wear at all. I've had SHS 15T's survive catastrophic PME literally without a scratch. I had a Lonex Red strip all it's plastic teeth in a similar scenario. I have also never had any issues with SHS 15T pistons.
 
#13 ·
The SHS 15 teeth piston is actually significantly more durable than a Lonex Red piston. By the time a Lonex Red is worn out, an SHS 15T will barely have any visible wear at all. I've had SHS 15T's survive catastrophic PME literally without a scratch. I had a Lonex Red strip all it's plastic teeth in a similar scenario. I have also never had any issues with SHS 15T pistons.
Ol maybe its "better" but go on youtube, maekii talks about how he doesnt like them but in all honesty theres nothing really wrong with them

Build the best dont buy the best
 
#14 ·
If I am not on any restrictive budget should I go with the siegetek 14.1 speed set? It seems it would be a better investment in the long run as they can be replaced if broken at no cost.
That might be a good idea but they are so excpensive that i wouldnt because shs are some what comparable to seigtech because the price is more than a fifth

Build the best dont buy the best
 
#15 ·
I'm just talking from practical experience. I have gotten much better results with SHS/DA 15T pistons than Lonex blue/red pistons, under similar conditions, therefore I consider DA/SHS 15T's to be a better choice. Lonex pistons have worn out after just one season, while I still haven't worn out any of my 15T pistons. I've had several Lonex pistons break, while none of my 15T pistons have failed so far. I've used 15T pistons in 50rps SSG setups, as well as a setup doing 32rps with an M150 spring, and so far I'm impressed with their durability.

I'm not trying to advocate one brand over another, and I'm not denying that other people may have a different practical experience, this is just my personal experience with the pistons in question.

OT: A set of Siegetek 14:1 ratio gears would be an excellent choice.
 
#16 ·
I'm just talking from practical experience. I have gotten much better results with SHS/DA 15T pistons than Lonex blue/red pistons, under similar conditions, therefore I consider DA/SHS 15T's to be a better choice. Lonex pistons have worn out after just one season, while I still haven't worn out any of my 15T pistons. I've had several Lonex pistons break, while none of my 15T pistons have failed so far. I've used 15T pistons in 50rps SSG setups, as well as a setup doing 32rps with an M150 spring, and so far I'm impressed with their durability.

I'm not trying to advocate one brand over another, and I'm not denying that other people may have a different practical experience, this is just my personal experience with the pistons in question.

OT: A set of Siegetek 14:1 ratio gears would be an excellent choice.
Ok, i didnt know you were running an ssg

Build the best dont buy the best
 
#20 ·
This would be your ROF on 10.44:1 gears with the following motors and batteries:

JG Blue (22TPA) 7.4v: 26rps
JG Blue (22TPA) 11.1v: 39rps

Frankentorque (28TPA) 7.4v: 20rps
Frankentorque (28TPA) 11.1v: 30rps

Frankentorque (32TPA) 7.4v: 18rps
Frankentorque (32TPA) 11.1v: 27rps

So if you go with a Frankentorque, you won't get the blistering ROF, but you will get amazing trigger response.
 
#21 ·
What spring should I use with 22 tpa to keep under 380 fps while having good trigger response and a high rof (around 39 rps)
 
#23 ·
So, If I get a full toothed swiss cheese piston, say an SHS lightened one, and I cut two teeth off that would make it good? Also, should I get a polymer or aluminum piston head to go with it?
 
#24 ·
For speed you need it to be light. Which ever of the two you select should be the lighter of the two. Skip the bearing units too, not needed and adds weight.
 
#27 ·
18:1 ratio DSG will do 35-40 RPS with a 22 TPA motor depending on spring strength etc. If you want close to 40 RPS SSG you'll need a lower TPA motor, a common combination is 16 TPA motor with 12:1 or 13:1 ratio gears. You will of course need a motor with strong neodymium magnets.
 
#28 ·
Think whole system, not one piece. This isn't a video game, this is real life and the aeg works as a whole system where the battery affects the motor and that affects the gear and that touches the piston and then that touches the spring....etc

Piece meal upgrades like a video game where you snap in piece B3 that you paid for with 10,000 or 400xp to give your weapon a 1.9 rof level increase is unrealistic.
 
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