Featured Fitting laser cartridge to GBB pistol

Discussion in 'Gas Powered Guns' started by K.R., Jul 17, 2021.

  1. K.R.

    K.R. Member

    32
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    Clemson
    I got the idea of fitting one of these to my GBB pistol
    https://smile.amazon.com/Votatu-Tra...094WFJRY8/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8

    I would just need to 3D print a casing that will fit it snugly into the outer barrel. Does anybody have experience with these laser cartridges and know how much force is needed to press the snap cap button? From a brief calculation, the green gas pistol should conservatively be able to exert ~2lb of force on the button.

    You can buy a pre-made laser adapter for airsoft but they cost like $250, I figure it would be easy enough to fit a $40 9mm cartridge if I can confirm that the button will be light enough to be activated by the green gas pressure.
    https://store.laser-ammo.com/recoil...-recoil-enabled-firearms-pistol-adapters.html
     
  2. K.R.

    K.R. Member

    32
    2
    Clemson
    If the off-the-shelf cartridge button is too stiff, my alternative is to self-rig a small laser pointer and hook it up to a small pressure button. I checked a button I have at home and it will press down with just 1lb of force; based on the area of the button surface that comes out to less than half the pressure of the green gas, so it should definitely work. But it's just more work to have to re-wire the laser pointer for the job....
     

  3. K.R.

    K.R. Member

    32
    2
    Clemson
    I found out that the laser cartridge button is very light, so shouldn't be an issue.

    But my other concern is-- will the GBB cycle properly with something completely obstructing the barrel. Any thoughts?
     
  4. Guges Mk3

    Guges Mk3 Administrator Staff Member Administrator Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

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    It will not work at all. There is no internal volume to put an object that large into a GBB and have it still "work".

    This is due to the GBB "requiring" the hop-up unit to seat and actuate the outer barrel. In No way will a 9mm dummy going to fit in a 6mm chamber.

    Plus...there is no extractor on a GBB that could grab that laser. It would be a waste of time...
     
  5. K.R.

    K.R. Member

    32
    2
    Clemson
    My plan is to remove the inner barrel. I've confirmed that the pistol cycles without the inner barrel. I've also checked that my 9mm dummy round fits into the outer barrel, so there is definitely space to fit the laser cartridge. The main question is, will the pistol cycle properly if I place a non-movable object directly in front of the nozzle?

    I feel like it is potentially feasible if I weaken the flute valve spring, so not as much gas needs to escape before the flute valve would close. Just a guess, not sure though.
     
  6. Guges Mk3

    Guges Mk3 Administrator Staff Member Administrator Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

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    Which GBB are you thinking about trying this with?

    90% of the GBB's on the market, the spring guide rests against the hop-up unit. Some models will have two points of contact, others one point when the hop-up is removed.

    And as you say it "will" manually cycle and weakening the flute valve spring will reduce gas output.
     
  7. K.R.

    K.R. Member

    32
    2
    Clemson
    EF G19X and KWA ATP (maybe, if I manage to get it fixed).

    Yes the spring guide tends to fall out when I field strip if the inner barrel is not there. But it does cycle... heh.

    I just had another idea, which is to design a Picatinny rail mount to hold the laser cartridge directly in front of the tip of the barrel. That will give the gas at the least the entire inner barrel to expand to help with cycling. The main question is, whether the gas would still have enough pressure by the time it gets to the tip of the barrel to exert a ~1lb force on the laser cartridge button. What's your intuition on this?
     
  8. Guges Mk3

    Guges Mk3 Administrator Staff Member Administrator Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

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    That going to be an issue of the G19X. It is only touching one tang and its off to the side.

    With the ATP...it will touch two points and would be a more stable platform.

    No need to reinvent the wheel.

    [​IMG]

    And no...it won't push the button.

    Fluid Dynamics says if the cartridge is plugging the barrel, gas will try and escape via the sides around the nozzle area. You will need a small hole in the front to allow the gas to move forward...
     
  9. K.R.

    K.R. Member

    32
    2
    Clemson
    What is the part you're showing called on Evike?

    If the gas is pushing out of the barrel at a high velocity, when it hits the button there would be a pressure generated at the stagnation point (i.e. think of momentum balance-- forward momentum is transferred to the impact surface as a force), that's what I'm hoping would be enough force to press the button. My ATP is completely non-functional at the moment so I can't quite test it to see how much stagnation pressure it would generate if you place something in front of the barrel.
     
  10. K.R.

    K.R. Member

    32
    2
    Clemson
    I could put a 6mm wooden skewer in the barrel to deliver the force. That way I can tune the length of the skewer so that I can get enough pressure force to press the button, but still leave enough room in the barrel for the pistol to cycle smoothly... it will be a wild experiment, hah
     
  11. Kuratosu

    Kuratosu Member

    57
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    Tucson
    I might be wrong here but you're looking to try to get a 6mm airsoft gun to be compatible with a 9mm bullet shaped object. Airsoft guns are designed to not be compatible with real steel bullets and or parts so they can never be converted. You'll spend less time, money, and frustration if you just picked up a real 9mm and used that instead. You'll likely end up breaking a lot of parts in your pistol trying to get it to work with this.
     
  12. Guges Mk3

    Guges Mk3 Administrator Staff Member Administrator Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

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    How would you have "pressure" at a stagnation point when the whole concept of a stagnation point is when the pressure is "zero". It can't push anything when it's "nothing".

    [​IMG]
     
  13. K.R.

    K.R. Member

    32
    2
    Clemson
    I do have a real 9mm firearm. I want to use my airsoft pistol for recoil practice with a laser cartridge. The 9mm cartridge will not fit directly into the airsoft, I will need to 3D print a holder to replace the inner barrel while at the same time holding the laser cartridge in place.

    Stagnation point is where velocity is zero and all of the kinetic energy is converted into pressure energy, and thus highest static pressure
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stagnation_point
     
  14. Guges Mk3

    Guges Mk3 Administrator Staff Member Administrator Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

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    When it's steady flow I can visualize that...but with gas and it being a pulse from the release of the material from a gas mag. I think the eye of the hurricane would be a better example of a Stagnation Point instead of your example.

    However, IMHO, you should just keep it simple and have use it as it was designed and benefit from the ability to put a projectile down range with relative accuracy and you can do draws, stoppage drills and mag changes too.
     
  15. GrimWolf0770

    GrimWolf0770 Active Member

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    Pittsburgh area
    I really don't get this idea at all......X~X
     
  16. K.R.

    K.R. Member

    32
    2
    Clemson
    The gas will produce a force on impact regardless whether the flow is steady or pulse — may be conceptually easier to just think of it as momentum balance. The main question is whether the force will be enough to press a button.

    The eye of storm isn't a parallel analogy to our situation. In the storm, the pressure gradient is in the direction perpendicular to flow velocity. That is, going from the "eye" to the "outside" of the storm, you are considering a direction that is perpendicular to the direction of the wind. In our case, the direction going from the nozzle to the impact point is parallel to gas flow.

    Yes I will certainly use the GBB in its normal operation (i.e. shooting a BB, ha). Just thought it would be interesting to add a laser ammo capability with a standard laser cartridge.

    GrimWolf: the idea here simplified, is that I'm considering putting a laser pointer cartridge inside a GBB pistol, so that when I press the trigger, the pistol will cycle and at the same time activate the laser to let me see where the bullet would hit.
     
  17. GrimWolf0770

    GrimWolf0770 Active Member

    234
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    Pittsburgh area
    Why? Just use the damn thing for what its made for.
     
    FuLL-eFFekT1 likes this.
  18. ma_airsoft

    ma_airsoft Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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    this system would be significantly cheaper than a RS trainer if he could figure out how to make it work. Thats why.
     
  19. Guges Mk3

    Guges Mk3 Administrator Staff Member Administrator Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

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    Well, here is some additional info.

    This was attempted by other using the M92 Platform with Japanese Valve system. The advantage of the J-Spec valve is that it has an actual tube to the bb and the flute valve is held open when resting on the bb. This system would be more suited for your needs for it could vent the gas onto the actuator button, However...no one uses a M92's any more...
     
  20. K.R.

    K.R. Member

    32
    2
    Clemson
    ma_airsoft likes this.