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Gun only feeds with active brake on? Plz help

5K views 43 replies 7 participants last post by  Guges Mk3 
#1 ·
Gun only feeds when I turn active break on slightly. I have tried trimming tappet plate coil, then I tried delayer chip, then I got a adjustable nozzle and tried every size. Nothing worked, I am gonna try trimming the tappet plate itself now. The sector gears i have are short stroked 3 teeth and the other is 4 teeth. Neither will feed. Do I need to short stroke my piston? How do I get my timing to be correct? Thanks

these are my parts

Brushless 36k warhead motor
13:1 SHS
M140 spring
Lonex bearings
Lonex gearbox
Shs piston metal rack
Polycarbonate piston head
Maxx adjustable air nozzle
Leviathan optical
2200mah specktrum battery 30c
 
#2 ·
The active breaking is probably just stopping with the nozzle open allowing it to feed better.

Is the packing (bucking) lips protruding into the hop up feed tube?

Is the tappet actually pulling back all the way?

It's likely one of those issues.

Also what mags and bbs have you tried? Some just suck and are a bit slower feeding and cause issues like this.

While timing is important, it isn't the cause of the feeding issue here. What sector chip are you using?
 
#7 ·
Im using the SHS delayer chip. The bucking is seated perfectly and I believe your correct about the active break causing the nozzle to be sitting open. I've adjusted to nozzle small enough to the point where it feeds even without a delayer chip or active break but then its so small it doesn't allow it get a good air seal. The tappet is definitely getting pulled back because when I turn active break on the nozzle stops completely retracted.

This is what makes no sense to me, the nozzle is 100% going back and being full retracted, it's almost like
It goes back so fast tho that the bbs can't feed in time. My cycle time
Is 33ms, I don't know If this is considered fast or not. I'm using pts epm and epm1 mags rn, they feed perfectly fine on this exact Setup at 40 rps full auto yet never want to feed in semi unless active breaked.
 
#5 ·
You bought a 36K motor for $200.00?

Brushless is not there yet....when you have a 45K motor that is conventional...and a bit faster.

More marketing BS to fleece the Airsoft population:

"Brushed motors are notorious for having parts that get worn out after a while, requiring frequent dismantling and parts replacement. This is because the brushes of the commutator need to maintain almost constant contact with the terminals of the power source, even as the commutator rotates rapidly. When brushes get worn out and can no longer maintain contact, a brushed DC motor basically becomes useless."

I really don't like this company now...I could buy 3 45K motors for the same price and have it last 8 years...and have 20.00 left over.

And they sell SHS gears for 40.00...oh yeah...late comer to the fleecing event.
 
#6 ·
Lol I bought this motor for the semi auto response not the "36k". It's so much faster then any of my 28 tpa motors in semi and insanely efficient with the amp draw. I get like 2x or 3x more shots on one charge. I came here for feeding help not to get **** on for buying a brushless motor lol
 
#9 ·
Getting poop for buying a brushless motor...no, that is not the intent of my comment. Charging you $200.00 for a new "fangled" motor...that is drawing my ire.

To many unscrupulous vendors.

Here's the thing...no one has ever quantified "trigger response time".

Granted it's not easily measured. You can get exceptional trigger response one of "two" ways, now 3 with a brushless motor.

HT Motor and HS Gears.
HS Motor and STD Gears.

And for some...HS Motor with HS gears.

Additional factors is battery capability, MOSFET pre-cocking...and a few other tricks depending on platform.

Back 8 years ago, I dropped the first 45K motor into a Stock G&P and ran it on a 2S LIPO. First P* guy I shot it against thought I was using HPA. Then he test fired it and said..."oh...my god, the Trigger Response...what did you do???" Uh...just dropped in a new motor...

So, if your happy with what you have...that is all that matters.

But, the issue with our industry...to many "lemmings"...there is more than one way to get TR and more knowledge is power...and good for the limited budget pocket books.
 
#11 ·
Getting poop for buying a brushless motor...no, that is not the intent of my comment. Charging you $200.00 for a new "fangled" motor...that is drawing my ire.

To many unscrupulous vendors.

Here's the thing...no one has ever quantified "trigger response time".

Granted it's not easily measured. You can get exceptional trigger response one of "two" ways, now 3 with a brushless motor.

HT Motor and HS Gears.
HS Motor and STD Gears.

And for some...HS Motor with HS gears.

Additional factors is battery capability, MOSFET pre-cocking...and a few other tricks depending on platform.

Back 8 years ago, I dropped the first 45K motor into a Stock G&P and ran it on a 2S LIPO. First P* guy I shot it against thought I was using HPA. Then he test fired it and said..."oh...my god, the Trigger Response...what did you do???" Uh...just dropped in a new motor...

So, if your happy with what you have...that is all that matters.

But, the issue with our industry...to many "lemmings"...there is more than one way to get TR and more knowledge is power...and good for the limited budget pocket books.
Look man I got it 140 and respect to whatever your opinions of my motor and other motors out there but I'm really just looking to get help on feeding and I don't want this thread to get off topic.
 
#10 ·
Cycle time and feed time don't completely correlate. The cycle speed and overspin changes a lot about trigger response. Overspin can be when a round loads, which is when the aeg is cycling slowly or it even stops open like I said.
I would check your mags and bbs.

Also those motors are substantially better than brushed motors in performance. Im going to have to disagree with guges on that.. I do not know how they do it, I tried some rc brushless motors a year ago and it didn't work out. However I've seen over a dozen builds using those brushless motors pulling crazy fast ssg and dsg builds on high speed gears. Some of them with weaker small 2 cell lipos. All without overheating and burning like a brushed motor can. I think the main advantage is the battery size, a shorter smaller gun can run as if you are a brick lipo on the side without the bulk.

However they are very expensive and they have more failure points than a brushed motor. I've only seen one however fail, it was a broken shaft which I'd say is due to horrible shimming by the user. Time will tell, but so far they seem to last.

Maybe if they become more common, supply and demand will get them down to a price worth getting.
 
#13 ·
You dont have to short stroke the piston unless you feel like it. Sector is enough.

While I don't think this is related to your problem I have a video regarding short stroking and tappet/piston timing. But it won't fix a feeding issue.

https://www.instagram.com/tv/CCCde_wnueb/?utm_medium=copy_link

Another factor is the tappet may be dragging on the sector if it was shimmed too high or the gearbox shell itself.
 
#16 ·
I’m using the lonex tappet cause my shs and rocket tappets are too thick for the lonex gearbox. The lonex tappet I have is well made and shaped well. It’s strong and doesn’t flex much. When testing the tappet and nozzle in the HopUp with no spring attached, the nozzle clears the HopUp perfectly. The nozzle is pulled back enough to the point where it feed bbs. But it still doesn’t feed them lol. Either way I’m clearly able to feed on active break which proves that my tappet is infact pulling my nozzle back enough. I’m so confused on what to do. I’m 100% positive if I tossed my stock 18:1 gears with the same exact tappet plate + nozzle setup, that it would feed perfectly.

At this point I don’t even know what to try
 
#20 ·
Did your stock 18:1 setup have a delay chip? Maybe compare where the first (pickup) tooth on the stock sector gear is in relation to the tappet stud and what it looks like on the new sector gear. From what you're saying it sounds like an issue with the sector gear/tappet stud not the tappet plate or nozzle.
 
#26 ·
Which circles around to another variable in the "system" that is an Airsoft gun. The Magazine.

Cheap mags...don't always feed very well.
 
#29 ·


This guy literally did the most involved testing of the most mags ever done by anyone.

However the video is a bit old and a few new mags exist, such as the bamf gen 2... I personally didn't like the bamf 2. Too much spring tension.

There's another mag I can't remember, it's expensive and has a counter built in... apparently those are really good. I'll remember in a bit
 
#28 ·
Arcturus/DDAY
PTS
TM
Beta Project
G&P
 
#35 ·
Sounds like the Maxx nozzle is too long.
 
#37 ·
Watch the first 3:40. I think he does not PTS mags...



If you end up watching the whole video, keep in mind his views on the Maxxx HopUp Units have changed for the better. What I mean by this is he realized just how bad they really are.
 
#38 ·
The max hopup units last I checked had like almost a 8mm clearance in the feed tube and chamber. And they have a offset feed tube due to a off spec issue snagging the bbs as they feed. It's like they didn't double check their design and focused entirely on the modular hop arm design they have.

If they just fixed those two issues then it would be literally the best m4 hop up ever designed. But the shortcomings still stand.

Seems many cnc shops struggle to properly design things these days.
 
#40 ·
It's the mindset of the people in this industry.

Most "fail" to see the "big" picture. They see just a segment and work around that and not the big picture. Plus, again...lack of standards too.

If they would "measure" a TM...they could make it better. Most likely they took a low cost unit and tried to improve that...or a clone of a clone, Prowin hop-up...
 
#42 ·
Tienly 45K

Seen here inside a G&P M4 with a stock 18:1 mechbox and a 2S 2600mah Kypom Lipo

Go to 2:00 mark.

 
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