Need a little advice

Discussion in 'General Airsoft Discussion' started by bob19922, Dec 4, 2012.

  1. bob19922

    bob19922 Active Member

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    Ok so here is the situation my friends decided they wanted to start a airsoft team, they asked me if I would like to join so I said yes. Now we all want to have the same camo and same color PC here is the problem. They wanted to make the color of the PC black I said that would be a bad choice and explained to them why that would be a terrible choice. But of course they said black PC or your off the team, of course you guys know I will never get a black PC I suggested Khaki or coyote brown because they work better with woodland marpat(the camo we chose) as well as our environment I don't know what to really do. Any really compelling arguments I could show them or just straight up facts that they would really make them re-think it? Also if they do refuse to change their minds what should I do?
     
  2. Knief

    Knief Moderator Moderator

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    I'll give you a write up when I have more time tomorrow morning. Honestly though, if they're going to kick you off the team because you don't want to wear the same gear as them, you might want to find a different team. These guys ckearky aren't treating you with respect or approaching team decisions with consideration for the members. They're being childish to the extreme, and essentialky trying to take their ball and go home.
     

  3. bob19922

    bob19922 Active Member

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    Thank you knief one of them said he doesn't mind because I put up an extremely valid point but the other two are just being headstrong for no apparent reason, I want try my best to work with them these are the people I've been friends with for a very long time. Maybe I could just show them that even the marines don't use black they uses coyote brown.
     
  4. marine121496

    marine121496 Wahahaha~ Supporting Member

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    Yeah, what knief said, I honestly wouldn't call people who didn't want me on their team, friends.
     
  5. brooksburnett5

    brooksburnett5 New Member

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    if they are going to be that up tight they will be like that on bigger choices i say just find a new team or start your own with some other friends
     
  6. Maxuhmize

    Maxuhmize Active Member

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    This. I wouldn't even try again just so you all don't get in an argument.
     
  7. S1kkguy

    S1kkguy New Member

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    The fact that the team can't respect each other's inputs and ideas on something arguably trivial, I think you're better off not being in the team. Maturity levels seem pretty poor and things like that can be the difference between winning and loosing a game. Communication and consensus are pretty essential to becoming an effective unit.
     
  8. Southpawlegend

    Southpawlegend New Member

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    Or what you could do is go ahead and let them get their gear, then own them by yourself because they stick out like orange safety vests.
     
  9. Yokomohoyo

    Yokomohoyo New Member

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    First and foremost, congratulations on deciding to join an team. Airsoft is always funner when played with friends that know what your doing and you know what they are doing.

    Second, explain to them that black is not a naturally occurring color in nature. So no matter how "cool" it looks, the human eye will always seek out the "black spot". That means that the opposing force will see your vests faster in black than say OD green or khaki/coyote brown.

    I hope that helps you out a bit.
     
  10. soviet

    soviet Active Member

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    There's a team around who use black shirts khaki pants and black tactical vest. The actually tend to blend in well.
     
  11. Knief

    Knief Moderator Moderator

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    Yokomohoyo gave a pretty nice concise description of the problem. Aside from volcanic rock, black just doesn't occur in nature in large patches. You get it inside of some flowers, on insects, small stuff like that. Never in chest sized patches, though. Just go out into the woods you play in and look around, ask your friends how much black they see. As it turns out, black is so much darker than what's actually out there that your eye is naturally drawn to it because of the contrast. It looks out of place, so it stands out about as much as neon pink does. I couldn't tell you the number of times I was able to spot a guy through brush because I could see his black vest. Had they been wearing tan or green, I never would have seen them. The stuff is like magnets for your eyes.

    On top of that, it just looks silly. Your friends probably think black looks cool because that's what you see all the time in movies and video games. As it turns out, black rarely looks good in real life. What's in their heads, the black clad storm trooper, is an image built up by movies and video games to look cool. What you're missing is the way both media use camera work, lighting, circumstance and the magic of editing to make that look good. In the real world, you're missing all of that. So instead, you just end up looking like a guy wearing a bunch of hot gear that makes you stand out in almost every environment.

    No major US military unit uses black in any significant way.

    CAG/ACE/Delta:

    [​IMG]

    Rangers:

    [​IMG]

    Special Forces:

    [​IMG]

    SEALs:

    [​IMG]

    Pararescue (PJs):

    [​IMG]

    MARSOC:

    [​IMG]

    Marine Force Recon:

    [​IMG]

    If you're using MARPAT, you want Coyote Brown gear. It's a color hand picked by the Marines to pair with MARPAT for the best effectiveness. If you want some semblance of realism, Marine infantry uses the SPC and MTV/IMTV, Marine Force Recon uses FSBE II stuff (CIRAS, RRV, and MBSS) and MARSOC uses a mixed back of stuff that includes the JPC and EPC/MBAV as well as FSBE II stuff, among others. MARSOC typically uses M81 woodland, but I don't think that's exclusive. They also tend use more khaki gear, like the rest of the SOF units out there.
     
  12. Protectionperfection

    Protectionperfection New Member

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    the "PMC" loadout of khaki pants and black shirt is normal and fine. they arent meant to blend into the environment.
    My team started out with that uniform and recently switched to camos
    we now run Dgitial Desert and Woodland.
    https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=480385335328754&set=t.1041634497&type=3&theater
    you can see in that picture that the black doesnt go all too well for actual camo purposes. It can look "Tacticool" but it doesnt help any. Now the new guy we have, came over with the tan vest and you can see how much better it works. He is less noticeable even in the picture that is supposed to showcase the people in it...

    The morale of the story is, khaki or Coyote coming soon
     
  13. Username94

    Username94 New Member

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    Going to play devil's advocate here and say that I've seen the SWCC use black PC's sometimes.
     
  14. Knief

    Knief Moderator Moderator

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    I think I've pretty well covered that infrequent and highly unique situation with the above clause. Also, got those photos?
     
  15. Username94

    Username94 New Member

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    Sorry I thought when you said "in significant way" you were referring to the size and purpose of the gear. My interpretation was "a black retention lanyard is insignificant however a black PC is significant."

    Oh and ask and ye shall receive :)


    swcc-gau-minigun.jpg



    SWCC_firing_M134.jpg



    021204-N-6492H-636.jpg
     
  16. LegacyAirsoft

    LegacyAirsoft You can say I tech a little... Moderator

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    The only reason I ran a black PC was because I had some "hand me down" gear and woodland bdus that would have looked to mismatched with coyote brown, however I am slowly switching my color of everything over to some sort of tan. Black has no advantages except it universally matches the rest of your gear...
     
  17. Knief

    Knief Moderator Moderator

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    Legacy,

    Woodland actually looks pretty sweet with CB or khaki gear. I submit for your consideration:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [side note: guess which pictures are airsoft!]

    Username,

    I get all giddy at that muzzle flash. Interestingly, the only pictures I was able to turn up of "SWCC" in black were training exercises with students.
     
  18. Username94

    Username94 New Member

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    Coyote brown works better than black....you sire have obviously not heard of the marines :p

    It took me a while to find them but I don't know if they are training exercises or not. And yes don't we all love that muzzle flash :)
     
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2012
  19. alex

    alex New Member

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    team colors are to distinguish themselves from other teams. if they picked out black PC, then you either comply or form your own team. there's a local team that used red shirts under their PC. mixing black with other patterns is also popular.
     
  20. Knief

    Knief Moderator Moderator

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    That'd be great advice and all if the team was in consensus or if it wasn't painfully obvious that at least a couple of the members care about not sticking out like a sore thumb. Or if your advice didn't boil down to, "do what other people tell you to and have no will of your own."
     
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2012