Oh where to begin

Discussion in 'Gun Building, Modifications & Repairs' started by Beetlebz, Aug 3, 2020.

  1. Beetlebz

    Beetlebz Well-Known Member

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    hey gang, been a long, long time. So the guys from work dragged me back into airsoft after what feels like a lifetime. I went online, grabbed a new 11.1 nunchuck, and immediately stripped the piston on my old CQB gun. Oh well. I put it in my old FMG4 and it seemed to run fine (albeit missing about 60fps). Decided it was fine for ONE game. It wasn't. Blew the piston in the pouring rain at beginning of game 3.

    Anyway my question is this. Im going to rebuild those guns and got all the parts on the way but for the sake of boring reliability I want a back up field gun. No hot rodded anything, just something that I can throw a 7.4 lipo in and never have to worry about it. I HAVE an old bone stock VFC 416C that I have never had open. Is that a good candidate for a shim, aoe, 120 spring or is it technologically eclipsed by any $199 hunk of pot metal that would provide better service? I have NO idea how far the designs have evolved.
     
  2. Guges Mk3

    Guges Mk3 Well-Known Member Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

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    Some have evolved, some have stayed the same. One thing for sure...parts are "less" compatible with each other over say 12 years ago.

    If your Bone stock VFC is running...leave it alone.
     

  3. Beetlebz

    Beetlebz Well-Known Member

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    It is and it isn't. The gun has never been opened before and has super low miles on it. Unfortunately because its been sitting so long between old compression parts and a compressed spring im seeing a hair over 300 fps at the muzzle. I was going to replace the piston o-ring, nozzle and main spring and leave everything else untouched. I have my pair of FMG4s that im going to re-hotrod.

    I just don't want to put my time into the VFC if it isn't going to be remotely competitive. The looking around ive done, the standard v2 stuff hasn't changed all that much. The VFC was pretty high end back in the day. Maybe ill do that and save the 13.1s for my other toys. Thanks for the input.
     
  4. Guges Mk3

    Guges Mk3 Well-Known Member Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

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    Don't replace anything until you actually checked it.
    Why are you replacing the nozzle?
    Spring I can see from leaving it compressed.
     
  5. Beetlebz

    Beetlebz Well-Known Member

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    I was going to replace the o-ring on the piston, maybe the cylinder head if its not super tight, and the nozzle because the whole thing is cheap easier to replace than the o-rings. But to be honest no, I haven't looked yet. I'm holding off until all my parts come in to make sure I have at least 1 working gun before I tear into another. The o-rings im replacing only because they have been sitting around for probably the better part of 7 or 8 years.
     
  6. Guges Mk3

    Guges Mk3 Well-Known Member Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

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    1. O-Ring on piston - Check first before replacing.

    2. O-Ring on Cylinder Head, take up gap with teflon tape. Far easier than trying to find the right size O-Rrings.

    3. You don't need an and O-Ring on the Nozzle...it does "nothing significant" for compression (Physics of Fluid Dynamic Principles working here...). If your nozzle isn't broken...leave it alone.

    Don't assume that your O-rings are bad. If the O-ring are made of Buna-N or Viton. They are good for 50+ years. Urethane...depends.

    Honestly...going in blind here is just a waste of money, time and effort.
     
  7. Beetlebz

    Beetlebz Well-Known Member

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    You know, I never thought of it like that. I guess it feels like if you aren't wrenching you're doing something wrong.

    Thank you for the guidance.
     
  8. Lefse

    Lefse Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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    Start by doing some basic maintenance, clean the parts and apply a moderate amount of fresh lubricant. Lithium based grease for the gears and such and pure silicone past for the air seal parts. You'd be surprised how much you can gain with just some basic maintenance.

    If you wanna take it a step further you can re-shim the gears, correct AOE, sand the front of the tappet plate slightly if the nozzle doesn't seal fully against the hop-up rubber and possibly replace the piston head o-ring.

    Guges is right on the money about the nozzle, you'd be surprised how little difference there actually is between an aftermarket o-ring nozzle and a well fitting non o-ring nozzle. The sealing point between the nozzle and hop-up rubber is much more critical.

    I used to replace the entire stock compression assembly in my AEG's before. These days I only replace compression parts if it's actually necessary. In my ICS M4 the only compression part I replaced is the piston head and that was because I damaged it, otherwise I would have kept it. I kept the stock cylinder head and non o-ring nozzle and it easily rivals the consistency of AEG's with all shiny new aftermarket compression parts.
     
  9. Beetlebz

    Beetlebz Well-Known Member

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    Appreciate the input gang. Im going to follow your advice, maybe even replace the spring with one a bit softer like a 110 to save wear and tear on the gun, leave everything else alone.

    If the AOE isn't great is it worth adjusting or should I just run it like it is?
     
  10. Guges Mk3

    Guges Mk3 Well-Known Member Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

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    VFC does not have any "major" AOE issues.

    If you install a Japanese made spring like a PDI170% You will be shooting around 390 out of the box and after 7 years...you will still be shooting around 390. Albeit still store it in an uncompressed state.

    The PDI170 I installed is going on 6 years and I still get 393fps off that thing.
     
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  11. Beetlebz

    Beetlebz Well-Known Member

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    To be honest I have no recollection as to what it chrono'd when it was new. It probably wasn't much hotter than it is now. Ill pick up that PDI170.
     
  12. Guges Mk3

    Guges Mk3 Well-Known Member Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

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    If you can't find any...I can part with one from my private stock.
     
  13. Wingman703

    Wingman703 Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    Your a real blast from the past Beetle. Good to have you back.
     
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  14. Beetlebz

    Beetlebz Well-Known Member

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    WINGMAN! Been a long time buddy! You know it's funny, the more things change the more they stay the same. I was back playing airsoft for less than 4 days before I had a whole new build ordered up for my old Zard-hopped m4 :D
     
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  15. Wingman703

    Wingman703 Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    Yeah. Not a ton of the older guys still active. Zard's been gone for years. I remain active on here but I don't think I've slung plastic in... 2 years at least.
     
  16. Beetlebz

    Beetlebz Well-Known Member

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    Sad story my friend. Funny enough, Zard lives or at least lived near by. I gamed with him once or twice same with @FLUGMERKUR . Haven't talked to him in forever. Seems like the forum has slowed down quite a bit. Its awesome there's still good folks like @Guges Mk3 around to help out re-noobs like myself. Its funny, I went out Saturday for my first time in probably 5 or 6 years... hit the advil after game 1 lol but I felt like a kid again. I wasn't the oldest guy out there so there is that.
     
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