The P90 - TM vs. Echo 1 Internals

Discussion in 'Electric Guns' started by Mike272, Jul 20, 2009.

  1. Mike272

    Mike272 New Member

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    Long-time lurker, first-time poster, anyways.


    From what I've read, Echo 1's P90 is a clone of TM's, but I was wondering who had the better internals, E1 or TM? Is the TM gearbox comparable to E1's ver.6 gearbox (performance wise)? I've read reports of upgraded TM P90's popping off 30 rounds in a second, is the E1 even capable of being upgraded to a similar extent?

    Secondly, (back to the original question) are Echo 1's internals a clone of TM's?

    I ask all this because I'm beginning to look into upgrading the internals on my new Echo 1 TR P90.

    Thanks for any feedback,
    ~M!


    P.S. Sorry for the numerous, albeit poorly phrased questions, but please forgive me, it's 3am where I am at the time of authoring
     
  2. Robin-Hood

    Robin-Hood Active Member

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    For one, TM and Echo-1 are classed in different leagues of manufacturer, secondly TM are renown for their amazing stock internals, stock TM aegs last forever, Also have you noticed pretty much everything half decent is TM Compatible.

    Imo TM will have superior internals stock as they all work together flawlessly and are well made however if you want to upgrade then Echo 1 (I think) has beefier internals to handle higher stock FPS of clone guns. Echo 1 and TM should be 100% compatible.
     

  3. hairyman

    hairyman New Member Supporting Member

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    The E1 comes with metal bearings,,,however as Mr Hood has said,the TM kicks its stubby little backside in every other aspect,,even if it is giving away 80 odd FPS.
     
  4. DaveRuination

    DaveRuination New Member

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    i'm running a tm p90 red dot - i've had a madbull tbb and systema metal bushings installed...no real improvement fps-wise, but this thing is super accurate now...i'm using a 9.6v battery and the rof is sweet - sure it's not li-poly speed, but it's still holding it's own...the main reason i went with tm over echo-1 (i was originally looking at this Evike.com - Airsoft Guns | Evike.com - Airsoft Electric Rifles | Evike.com - Matrix | Evike.com - Evike Matrix Custom P90 Terminator Full Size Airsoft AEG. | ) was the place i play at is 350 fps or less - the echo 1's are more like 380 out of the box, so i would've had to downgrade it, and from all my research i've found that a tm is a better investment in the long run - cuz we all know that fps alone isn't the end all and be all (and i'm sure that with an upgraded spring this thing would be even more sick if you need more fps)...i've talked to a guy who's got a 10 year old tm mp5 - it's lasted him 10 years with no problems...he just installed a new high torque motor and stuff because the 10 year old motor finally gave out...and just last week there was a guy who has all echo 1 guns - an m4 and a g36c - neither were working, and he couldn't figure out what exactly was wrong with them...i can guarantee that neither of those were 10 years old (he also just sold an echo 1 aug)...as they say, you get what you pay for...go with the tm - you won't regret it
     
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2009
  5. Sparky_D

    Sparky_D Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    I ran my TM P90-TR stock for 4 years before upgrading the spring to a Guarder SP-110 and Hurricane bushings 3 years ago. Everything else in the gun is bone stock, even the hop up bucking (why mess with a good thing?).

    In it's stock form at 285 FPS, I was easily able to keep up with other stock AEGs.
    Now at 7 years old with the SP110 (380 FPS), I can still keep up with all but the most upgraded guns on our fields.

    As for Echo-1 and KS P90's, yes they have 7mm metal bushings (no oval bushings either), but several local players I know have them and I keep hearing stories of inconsistant performance, poorly made hop up chambers, jamming and misfeeding magazines, and bad wiring.

    One friend in particular has finally gotten his Echo-1 P90 to perform reliably and consistantly within field FPS limits, but it's still not as accurate as my TM.

    Total cost for this including the gun? Around $350 and well over 10 hours of labor.

    My TM P90? $285 + $12 + $20 = $317 and about 1 hour.
     
  6. blackcat

    blackcat Guest

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    off topic but ive heard very good things bout ca proline
     
  7. Sparky_D

    Sparky_D Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    Hairyman had one. Nothing but problems for him.
    I also know one local who has one. He told me it was worse than any E-1 P90 he'd worked on, and he is the local P90 expert.
     
  8. Krazyboy87

    Krazyboy87 New Member

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    tm p90 is far superiour to the e1 version.
     
  9. hairyman

    hairyman New Member Supporting Member

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    My CA P-90 RDS has never been fired competatively,,its never worked long enough,,:mad:
     
  10. Grinder060

    Grinder060 New Member

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    Just to add on to what everyone else has said look at this comparison by AirsoftGI: Airsoft GI - Welcome to the ultimate airsoft retailer. Airsoft GI is

    While it doesn't really say which one is most reliable and which one performs the best (even though we all know it's the TM). It gives some information on the internals of the E90 and some information on the TM and CA.
     
  11. blackcat

    blackcat Guest

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    wow that must stink i wonder if you just got a lemon or what
     
  12. willbarber

    willbarber New Member

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    Nah, just some CA guns are good, some are bad.
     
  13. DaveRuination

    DaveRuination New Member

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    even tho the tm is mostly plastic, it feels solid, so don't let the plastic body put you off
     
  14. Robin-Hood

    Robin-Hood Active Member

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    Same with the G&G Combat Machines (Which aren't actually plastic they're virgin polycarbonate afaik) you can pretty much throw these things off buildings etc and they will be fine.
     
  15. Mike272

    Mike272 New Member

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    Wow, just slightly biased towards Marui here, are we? :rolleyes:
     
  16. PatentPending

    PatentPending New Member

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    I run with a E1 P90 and have never had a problem except when I took it apart without knowing how to put it back together. I play exclusively CQB though so I only need a 100ft accuracy which I get with stock internals along with a downgraded spring.

    Robin Hood, are you saying I could upgrade my motor without worrying about my gears? FPS isn't a problem but a higher ROF would help.
     
  17. Grinder060

    Grinder060 New Member

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    If you want to increase ROF, get a 9.6 volt, that is if you haven't already. I'm not for certain on the motor, but I would believe it would be fine with a good shim job.
     
  18. Sparky_D

    Sparky_D Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    Nah, not biased. That would infer that we were unfair in our assesment of the other brands.

    I firmly believe, quality and peformance wise, that the TM P90 is the superior model currently available.
    While the KS/Echo-1 has features I would love to see on the TM (standard 7mm bushings), and CA offers an affordable RDS version, there are just too many doccumented quality issues to ignore.

    Not to say there aren't some KS/E-1/CA P90's out there running great, but in the general scheme of things, a problematic TM is the exception, whereas a problematic KS/E-1 or CA seems to be more prevalent.
     
  19. Robin-Hood

    Robin-Hood Active Member

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    I'm pretty sure it would take a 9.6v without any trouble. Idk about upgrading the motor, shouldn't be necessary.

    +1 to Sparky. TM, although not my style at all make some amazing airsoft weapons. Why do you think everything is TM Compatible? :)
     
  20. hairyman

    hairyman New Member Supporting Member

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    When it comes to outright reliability vs stock performance nothing gets close to a TM aeg,,hell i know people who have given in a TM aeg to have it upgraded from 280fps to 330fps on the crono and have actually noticed a drop in engagement distance,,,,they are the only aeg's id consider leaving stock.